Treatment for Reducing Arterial Plaque and Imflammatory Cells:

BobM Bob if it wasn't Mayo I would say something to the effect the recommendation was in the vain of Male Bovine Fecal Matter. 

I f you google low cholesterol and all cause mortality you will find multiple papers that found cholesterol can be too low and result i n cancer, liver disease and dementia to name a few. To reach 30 you will have to reduce total C to about 100.

Be careful. 

BobM So do you have heart disease or some sort of issue that you are trying to resolve like a bad cimt test or high calcium score or is this strictly prevention?

BobM LDL doesn’t tell you what you need to know.  Nee CIMT or CAC. If either is getting worse doesn’t matter what your cholesterol is. 
 

plus low LDL is associated with higher all cause mortality. My dad was on statins and died of sepsis - a common outcome of low LDL

BobM The mayo clinic operates in a very traditional orthodox conservative antiquated fashion and these kind of docs usually are operating on 15-20 year old data. Dont be fooled because it is the mayo clinic or he is a top doc, they are behind. If you want some good information just do your own research. Read track your plaque by dr davis and other information out there.

Fred Cloud Whoever (doctor and institution) put in his stents did him no favor.  Stents only help if there is a mycardial infarction.  Due to financial considerations and just plain tradition, the medical industry just keeps doing what has been shown not to work.

Fred Cloud Fred you are full of it with respect to your comments on Mayo. My wife was rescued by Mayo Docs  from procedures undertaken by numerous Chicago area physicians. Suggest you take trip to Rochester Mn., and talk to numerous individuals in the waiting rooms of the Mayo facilities who will relay to you the same message that I just relayed to you about Mayo rescuing their family members.

I was also surprised by what the Mayo Doc in Az told Bob and agree with you on the Davis book. As I told Bob in earlier comments, I am alive today because of my visits to Davis in Wis. based on articles in wrote for LEF after I had emergency bypass over 25 years ago.

Bob if you are reading this,  and as I told you before, go fish oil and statins and thank you Dr. Davis for putting me on the fish oil/statin path . Fish oil is miraculous for those of us who are prone to ischemic heart attacks. and is still dismissed by the majority of cardiologists. I recently was looking for a cardiologist after my cardiologist retired. One I visited said fish oil was worthless. Anther told my wife she could stop taking it.

Peter H. Howe I am not saying every doc at mayo is worthless, sorry, didnt mean to imply that, I mean just in this category of cardio prevention they seem very behind and are operating under research that seems very very old and outdated which you seem to agree with me on. If the mayo cardio guy is their best and is only looking at ldl and thinks the lower the better and is ignoring particle size and doesnt believe in CIMT testing then it's obvious he isn't anywhere near current with research.

Fred Cloud Thanks for the clarification. I agree with you on the specific Doc. Since seeing Bob's E-mail, I am toying with the idea of sending letter to head of Cardio at Mayo in Rochester ( know Bob was treated in AZ) and suggest that Mayo take up fish oil/statin research or summarize existing information and develop protocol that incorporates both in treatment to prevent ischemic heart attacks in those of us who are vulnerable.

There are 600,000 deaths/year in U.S. due to ischemic heart attacks and most are probably preventable if statin/fish oil therapy is applied. 

Note my existing cardiologist will not prescribe over the counter fish oil even though it is 10 X cheaper and contains both EPA and DHA.  My wifes cardiologist believes that all fish oil  it is of little or no value. The first cardiologist I visited after my mine retired stated that the only reason I use fish oil is because I am a fish biologist. This clinic (North Shore) is affiliated with Mayo which is why I went there. I have mitral valve prolapse due to whooping cough I contracted in mid 1940's and need to be close in case something happens. My retired cardiologist was also of the opinion that fish oil was of little value. I stopped seeing Dr. Davis about 15 years ago as he was not convenient and the cholesterol problem was resolved..

I do not blame the cardiologists position on fish oil as they are only parroting AHA  and do not want to be held responsible.  Note AHA just accepted prescription fish oil in terms of its ability to prevent heart attacks ~2 years ago after the paper on Vasepa. 

I use Consumers Lab analyses to make my  fish oil selection. In this regard the latest post did not contain my current choice (Natures Bounty) that I selected based on their analyses ~4 years ago. In this regard the most recent analyses did not contain an analyses of Natures Bounty but did for Life Extension and Kirkland both of  which passed. 

Lets see what happens. If I prepare letter will send all a copy.

Bunch of good posts for Bob. My opinion Bob based on several papers is the best indicator of your treatments is the triglycerides/HDL ratio. A ratio of one essentially means there is no probability of an ischemic heart attack. As Ii recall from your blood test you were below one.

Peter H. Howe I take 1,500mg of a vascepa equivalent supplement. How much do you take?

Fred Cloud Fred, I am going to get a little wordy in an effort to justify my actions. 

 I take 3 Natures Bounty capsules 2X/day. Each capsule has 647 mg of EPA and 253 mg of DHA for a total omega fatty acid of 5.4 grams for the 6 capsules per day. The oil is molecularly distilled to remove contaminants.

I also take 10 mg Lipitor/day with the goal of maintaining a Triglyceride/ HDL ratio of one. This ratio will prevent an ischemic heart attack and plaque buildup and is indicative of optimum LDL-P.  I take the amount recommended by Barry Sears and by Dr. Davis for those of us who have cardiac problems. At this level and with the lipitor my Total C is ~150 and my triglycerides and HDL about 70 each. There is some variation. This was worked out by Dr.  Davis 20 years ago. There is no question in my mind that I am here today (80 in Oct.) in good health thanks to LEF and Dr. Davis after my emergency bypass 26 years ago. I came across Dr. Davis in some of his writings for the LEF magazine.

Without the Lipitor my Total C approaches 250 and LDL-C ~140 based on 2 year study of myself I conducted about 2 years ago. So I have to have the Lipitor. I did the study to see if it would increase testosterone as I am hypogonadal. It did not. Some of the literature indicates that one of the problems with lowering cholesterol too much is that it decreases steroids as cholesterol is basis for steroids.

Note that Vesepa does not contain DHA which is critical to prevent brain shrinkage and depression and to promote neurogenesis among some of its benefits. You can verify DHA benefits with google search. 

Cost /bottle at Costco when on sale is $15.00 for a bottle of 130 capsules. They go on sale every other month.

I made this choice based on analysis by Consumer Labs ~ 4 years ago. Prior to that, I used the LEF's mega EPA/DHA. Natures Bounty is less expensive and more convenient.

However, as I indicated in previous post, Consumer Labs did not do an analysis of Natures Bounty in its last fish oil analyses a couple of months ago. They found that one of LEF's brands (not mega EPA/DHA which they did not analyze) and Costco's Kirkland brand as most cost efficient and highest quality. 

Again, I apologize for the wordiness.  

BobM Bob,thanks for the heads up.  I literally have no idea. It was my understanding that fish oil improves the immune system. I will have to investigate. I would never  never stop my fish oil. I try to keep my immune system boosted with DHEA, whey protein, probiotics, zinc, NAC and  a few other supplements/foods. 

Peter H. Howe Well Bob you kind of ruined my day. I followed up with ref in Consumer Lab and googled the issue and came up with following extensive review article:   ttps://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6834330/#B18-ijms-20-05028b.

Most of the googled paper is above my pay grade but it does conclude, along with the Consumer Lab citation, that fish oil can decrease immunity, but with all things biological, its complicated.

In my case, I will continue at my current use ( 5 gm/day)as I have been taking for over 20 years and have not experienced  any major infections. I do check my CBC and immune cell counts at least a couple of times per year and they are in normal range. This also includes the N/L and L/M ratios that I calculate myself from the CBC reports. 

There is no question that fish oil does depress inflammation and proinflammatory transcription factors and cytokines. I have no indication of any arthritis or joint problems and the literature supports this benefit.

Thanks for the heads up will keep my "eyes open".

BobM Bob, sent my second response to your question to myself. See above thread.