Details of dasatinib + quercetin study

What were the dosages of dasatinib and quercetin used for this study? What kind of quercetin was used? Any issues or side effects noted so far?

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  • Hi Ozone, thanks for the question. 

    The researcher conducting that study intends to publish the full details in a peer-reviewed journal once the study is completed. 

    Reply Like 1
    • Maximus may we presume the triggering of autophagy by fasting does not mimic chemical intervention?

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      • Max Petomoderator
      • Researcher, website & forum admin
      • Maximus
      • 6 mths ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      Joseph bailry III Hi Joseph. 

      From my understanding, that is not a simple question to address, though I recently came across a recent research report that suggests that fasting does not have the same effects as chemical intervention like rapamycin. 

      Basically, fasting reduces mTOR, but senescent cells seem to keep mTOR elevated all the time, even under fasting-like conditions. Chemicals like rapamycin seem to "force" mTOR to turn down, even in senescent cells that usually have it elevated all the time. 

      Turning mTOR down generally enhances autophagy. 

      Thus, compounds like rapamycin could be expected to have effects that fasting will not. 

      Reply Like 2
      • Christine
      • Christine
      • 12 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Max Peto Have there been any studies that combine intermittent or prolonged fasting with rapamycin and/or metformin?

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      • BobM
      • BobM
      • 12 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Max Peto 

      Can anyone discuss dasatinib Vs rapamysin  ? What are the benefits of each? Negatives?

      Thanks!

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      • Max Petomoderator
      • Researcher, website & forum admin
      • Maximus
      • 11 days ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      BobM Comparing dasatinib and rapamycin is a good topic to consider. Unfortunately, exploring the details can take up far too much space on this forum. But here are a few points of my own: 

      1. Dasatinib and rapamycin appear to work by two different mechanisms. Because of this, they don't seem like the most intuitive pair to contrast against one another. 

      2. Both of them may affect senescent cells to some degree, but dasatinib does this more directly (rapamycin may not do so unless other conditions are met). 

      3. I know little about dasatinib's toxicity, but I'm confident that rapamycin can be quite toxic if taken in too high of doses, if taken for too long, or both. Please use caution and read the relevant toxicity research before self-experimenting with either compound. 

      Reply Like 1
      • Max Petomoderator
      • Researcher, website & forum admin
      • Maximus
      • 11 days ago
      • Reported - view

      Christine Neat idea Christine. I have considered this possibility and have actually done it myself, taking 5 mg rapamycin during a 24-hour fast on several occasions. My thinking was that the fasting may help enhance autophagy, partly by causing a reduced availability of amino acids, so mTOR activity may be even more impaired (and possibly senescent cells better starved). I'm not confident this regimen did anything particularly positive for me, however.  

      Some people recommend taking rapamycin with metformin to help control blood sugar; maybe that's a good idea. I'm concerned about my glucose going too low as it is. Moreover, rapamycin, metformin, and fasting are all catabolic interventions--they enhance the body's deconstruction and inhibit it's ability to repair. I'm cautious about combining too many catabolic interventions at the same time until that has been shown to be safe. 

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      • Christine
      • Christine
      • 10 days ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Max Peto Cool experiment! It would be nice to see it tried also with different doses and different durations of fasts. From what I have gathered, a 14 hour fast is sufficient to induce some autophagy in most people, but it takes more time to reach optimal levels of autophagy. That said, there may be a lot of variation between people. Do we have any way to measure autophagy levels directly?

      I do want to try combining Metformin with basic intermittent fasting 14/10 and 16/8. I currently find that lifestyle/IF alone control my blood sugar better than Metformin alone, but want to find out more. (Once I have found a good panel for EU and have a home blood ketone meter for extra safety.) Actually, over time I am thinking of trying a protocol of 3 months with basic lifestyle/IF 14/10 in combination with Metformin and Rapamycin, alternated with 3 months of no meds but increasing the duration of fasting up to 72 hours. 48-72 hour fasts seem to be able to induce optimal levels of stem cell regeneration. Metformin does seem to be risky during prolonged fasts, as it impairs gluconeogenesis in the liver, so I would probably want to avoid longer fasts within a month of taking Metformin. I do wonder if there is any risk when ketone levels are high enough to provide energy to the brain.

      Is there any consensus on what is too low in blood sugar for various groups?

      On wiki I found this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hypoglycemia:

      "

      The glucose level that defines hypoglycemia is variable. In diabetics a level below 3.9 mmol/L (70 mg/dL) is diagnostic.[1] In adults without diabetes, symptoms related to low blood sugar, low blood sugar at the time of symptoms, and improvement when blood sugar is restored to normal confirm the diagnosis.[5] This is known as the Whipple's triad.[5] Otherwise a level below 2.8 mmol/L (50 mg/dL) after not eating or following exercise may be used.[1] In newborns a level below 2.2 mmol/L (40 mg/dL) or less than 3.3 mmol/L (60 mg/dL) if symptoms are present indicates hypoglycemia.[4] Other tests that may be useful in determining the cause include insulin and C peptide levels in the blood.[3] Hyperglycemia, a high blood sugar, is the opposite condition.

      Throughout a 24‑hour period blood plasma glucose levels are generally maintained between 4–8 mmol/L (72 and 144 mg/dL).[16]:11 Although 3.3 or 3.9 mmol/L (60 or 70 mg/dL) is commonly cited as the lower limit of normal glucose, symptoms of hypoglycemia usually do not occur until 2.8 to 3.0 mmol/L (50 to 54 mg/dL).[17]

      In cases of recurrent hypoglycemia with severe symptoms, the best method of excluding dangerous conditions is often a diagnostic fast. This is usually conducted in the hospital, and the duration depends on the age of the patient and response to the fast. A healthy adult can usually maintain a glucose level above 50 mg/dL (2.8 mM) for 72 hours, a child for 36 hours, and an infant for 24 hours. The purpose of the fast is to determine whether the person can maintain his or her blood glucose as long as normal, and can respond to fasting with the appropriate metabolic changes. At the end of the fast the insulin should be nearly undetectable and ketosis should be fully established. The patient's blood glucose levels are monitored and a critical specimen is obtained if the glucose falls. Despite its unpleasantness and expense, a diagnostic fast may be the only effective way to confirm or refute a number of serious forms of hypoglycemia, especially those involving excessive insulin.

      The precise level of glucose considered low enough to define hypoglycemia is dependent on (1) the measurement method, (2) the age of the person, (3) presence or absence of effects, and (4) the purpose of the definition. While there is no disagreement as to the normal range of blood sugar, debate continues as to what degree of hypoglycemia warrants medical evaluation or treatment, or can cause harm.[18][19][20]

      Deciding whether a blood glucose in the borderline range of 45–75 mg/dL (2.5–4.2 mM) represents clinically problematic hypoglycemia is not always simple. This leads people to use different "cutoff levels" of glucose in different contexts and for different purposes. Because of all the variations, the Endocrine Society recommends that a diagnosis of hypoglycemia as a problem for an individual be based on the combination of a low glucose level and evidence of adverse effects.[5]

      "

      Reply Like 1
  • Does anyone know what Compounding Pharmacy carrries Dasatinib?

    Reply Like 1
      • Kerry
      • Kerry
      • 8 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Brennan I continue to inquire but so far only sources from India and China. I am frozen in action. How about you.?

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      • BrendaFromSoCal
      • BrendaV in Calif
      • BrendaFromSoCal
      • 7 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Kerry Do these sources require a prescription? If not will you post the links?

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      • Peter5.0
      • peter50
      • 5 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Kerry in another discussion, someone posted that they had labs test the quality of the Indian drugs vs the US made ones and the quality seemed to be equal. That encourages me to buy the dasatinib from the Indian sites. 

      Reply Like
    • Brennan

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    • Brennan Contact dropshipmd.com generic Dasatinib cost:

      bottle of 60-50mg = $280.00

      bottle of 60-70mg = $300

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      • jpurc
      • jpurc
      • 3 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Brennan  I am obtaining my Dasatinib from an Indian company which also supplied me with Rapamycin and Metformin. I have been very happy with their products and their prices were very reasonable compared with others.

      their email :- trademedimpex@gmail.com

      Reply Like
    • Brennan Contact dropshipmd.com They're in India. For $330 I ordered 60-70mg tabs of Dasatinib. Caveat Emptor!

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      • jpurc
      • jpurc
      • 3 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      @jerry searcy Yes Jerry dropshipmd.com is the Company I deal with and they are an Indian company. I can't comment on the purity of their product, but you will be impressed with the packaging, if that is anything to go by!

      Their email address is:- trademedimpex@gmail.com and I deal with a very obliging man called Soni Jain.

      Hope that helps.

      Jean ( jpurc30659)

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    • BrendaFromSoCal there is a place in Florida now that will do it for $225 for a years worth

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      • Max Petomoderator
      • Researcher, website & forum admin
      • Maximus
      • 11 days ago
      • Reported - view

      murray flewelling jpurc  jerry searcy  Brennan 

      I have just created a post about two interesting options for obtaining dasatinib which I think you may want to consider. 

      https://forum.age-reversal.net/t/m20d78/sources-of-dasatinib

      Reply Like
    • Brennan ... compounding pharmacies are everywhere near you if you live in a city. Use google. If you request in advance they can order it for compounding. Use goodrx for a lower price. Or buy it from this age reversal site as shown elsewhere on this site.

      Reply Like
    • Brennan    I received a supply from this intermediary: Avinash Singh
      Medicate International pvt ltd
      WhatsApp : +919582467581
       

      Let me know if you try it out to compare results.

      Reply Like
  • Attached is a chart showing the dosages that were used.

    Reply Like 3
      • RobH
      • RobH
      • 10 days ago
      • Reported - view

      djmichel These dosages can be closely calculated by multiplying the weight in pounds by 1.1 (110%) for Dasatinib, and 10 times that for Quercetin.

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  • In process of a trial of Dasatinib and Quercertin.  Begin yesterday morning, at 9:30am  I calculated the dosage at 200mg Dasatinib and 2000mg Quercertin.   I was able to obtain 20 mg tabs of Dasatinib, so I took 10 tabs.  I obtained 500mg tabs of Quercertin, I took four of these.  I noticed at approximately 3-4 hours very mild nausea, but no vomiting.  I took the trial on an empty stomach and at 4 hours had a cup of soup, no problem and it resolved the nausea.  All was well all day until around 8pm when I ran a mile fever of 99-100 degrees.  Took a 500mg Asprin and I went to bed at 9:30 with chills , low grade headache and general malaise.  I had chills for several hours, and slept on and off over the course of the evening.  Woke up at 8am today, no fever or chills, just a little tired.  All of this seems to be inline with reported symptoms by other experimenters.  Will advise if any physiological change.

    Reply Like 2
      • djmichel
      • CDR Phx
      • djmichel
      • 7 mths ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      David Michel Just an update at 5 days post ingestion of D+Q.   The aftermath is that I have been tired, and a little brain fog.  This hit me harder that I though it would, but as I am 76 years old I suppose I have more Senescence cells than a younger person and correspondingly more die off. I am still going to do the second dose this Monday, but not looking forward to it.  I will advise of the outcome.

      Reply Like 2
      • djmichel
      • CDR Phx
      • djmichel
      • 7 mths ago
      • 3
      • Reported - view

      David Michel Begin my second round of D+Q this morning, one hour ago.  Took on an empty stomach so the dosage does not compete with other nutrients or drugs.

      Reply Like 3
      • djmichel
      • CDR Phx
      • djmichel
      • 7 mths ago
      • 2
      • Reported - view

      David Michel Day two of the second round of D+Q.  The second round has been much easier than the first round.  I had no symptoms other that a mild headache which resolved with a 500mg aspirin.  I had to chills or fever. Second day feeling normal.  I think the first round must have removed a number of Senescence cells that were sensitive to D+Q so by the second round there probably were not a lot to remove.  This makes me think if studies say the D+Q combination only remove 1/3 of Senescence cells the remaining cells must require another protocol. 

      Reply Like 2
      • djmichel
      • CDR Phx
      • djmichel
      • 7 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      David Michel I had no fever or chills.

      Reply Like 1
    • David, at 76 do you  have now or in the past had any joints with arthritis?  You are one of the best self testers on this site. I am 70 and use metformin, fisetin, aspirin, quercetin, coq10, and a few other hard to remember named supliments. I am considering rapamycin and dasatinib when I can get script.

      Second question, have you heard of any rapamycin users who have reported cataracts, or testecular atrophy from intermitant  rapamycin use? 

      Reply Like
      • djmichel
      • CDR Phx
      • djmichel
      • 7 mths ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      are we there yet  If I have any arthritis it is very slight, occasionally I seem to have positional postural stiffness, and have had some idiopathic peripheral neuropathy  which seems to have not been hurt or helped by my testing. 

      You don't need script to order out of the country.  

      As to  any side effects of Rapamycin, I am taking Sirolimus which is another name for Rapamycin.  I have been taking it for two years.  I have made the following observations:  About 6 months into taking 6mg weekly, I developed idiopathic nausea and vomiting.  Doc's could find no reason for this, however I stopped taking rapamycin for 3 months and resumed at 5mg  every two weeks ,as I take a lot of things that reduce MTOTC1. There have been some report of stomach problems associated with Rapamycin thinning  mucous membrane and this may have been the cause of my nausea and vomiting, but who knows.  It has not returned.

      It is frustrating to me that I cannot find a local doc who will monitor for me, however to stop, in my opinion, is like being in an airplane headed straight toward the ground with no pilot and failing to try to fly the airplane.  Time waits for no man and at my age I do not intend to sit idly by and pontificate on why I should not experiment.  I wish that I had unlimited funds to test my results but I will not let that stop me from searching for a solution to slowing aging.   

      Reply Like 1
    • David  Thank you. I found a local Dr. in Houston that will likely give script for sirolimus next monday. She was very intrigued by dr.Alan Greens website but wanted to read more before writing script.  So I will likely add Rapamycin to my experimentation. First I want to do a new full lab panel and aecho cardio  for cardiac ejection fraction for a baseline for later reference.

      I am 70 and agree with you David, that at our age , wise experimentation is better than waiting for finished studies.

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      • jpurc
      • jpurc
      • 3 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      djmichel  Hi   I 

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  • David, How did you find a physician in your area who would prescribe dasatinib?

    Reply Like 1
      • jpurc
      • jpurc
      • 3 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Brenda Van Dyke       Hi Brenda,  Further up this page you will see that I have replied to Brennan regarding a source of  Rapamycin, Metformin  and Dasatinib. No Dr prescription required  and excellent prices.

      Reply Like
      • BrendaFromSoCal
      • BrendaV in Calif
      • BrendaFromSoCal
      • 3 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      jpurc Thanks for the info!

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  • I didn't, my physician just put his head in the sand.  I found a source in India who does not require script.   This is one of my largest concerns, trying to find a Doctor who is leading edge and not afraid to prescribe off label.

    Reply Like
      • BrendaFromSoCal
      • BrendaV in Calif
      • BrendaFromSoCal
      • 8 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      David Michel 

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  • If you read the section on Rapamycin you will see where I listed a company in Indian through which I obtain Rapamycin, this is the same company I purchase Dasatinib from.....

    Reply Like 1
  • Thank you David, I will look for the section on Rapamycin, I get mine from IAS. You are right about the doctors, they are all afraid of the tyranical FDA, the enforcement arm of Big Pharma.

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  • Dasatinib 60x 20 mg tablets (Sprycell) available from www.antiaging.clinic (entry code 'Research') to be uploaded this week. They donate 15% to research. 

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  • What is the cost?

    Reply Like
      • IAS Phil
      • IAS_Phil
      • 5 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Ozone8  this European brand is $1499

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      • jpurc
      • jpurc
      • 3 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      Ozone8 

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      • jpurc
      • jpurc
      • 3 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      jpurc Hi  Ozone8

      Here is the email address of the company in India where I buy my products.

      trademedimpex@gmail.com I suggest you email them for prices.

      I have bought Rapamycin, Metformin  and Dasatinib from them at very reasonable prices. Their pills are well presented individually in bubble packs and very businesslike response to your order. I am very happy with this company.

      It will supply these products without a Doctor's prescription.This is fine for me as I live in the UK where it would be impossible to buy them here. 

      Just to give you an example of the cost.  I paid £128 for 2x2. doses of Dasatinib for my husband and myself.  Quercetin you can buy without prescription from Amazon quite cheaply. Just make certain you follow the recommended chart to receive the right dosage.

      Good luck,  Jean

      Reply Like
      • Ozone8
      • Ozone8
      • 3 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      jpurc  Jean,

      Thanks for the reply. Could you please also provide the website address for the company you mentioned. It looks like the name may be MD Supply located in India.

      Also, I'm not sure what is meant by "2X2. doses" of Dasatinib. Does that mean two doses for two people? How many capsules is that and how much Dasatinib in each capsule? Thank you.

      Reply Like
    • Ozone8 If they have a website I don't know of it. My impression is of a rather small company in India that somehow gets these drugs and resells them. My contact is through dropshipmd.com I have a bottle of 60-70mg Dasatinib capsules on the way (I hope). The cost was $330.00. At this point I'm forced to get political (my apologies): Its due to Democrats and Republicans that we can't go to a pharmacy and buy this stuff at free-market prices. Vote Libertarian!

      Caveat Emptor.

      Reply Like
      • djmichel
      • CDR Phx
      • djmichel
      • 3 mths ago
      • Reported - view

      jerry searcy I have purchased through this company several times and they always deliver.  Coming from India can take a little time but I have always received my order. I have ordered both rapamycin, and Dasatinib.  The rapamycin was delivered in a one mg tab and the Dasatinib in 20mg tablets.

      Reply Like
  • Ouch!

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  • 03/20/19, just received bottle of Dasatinib. They seem o.k to me.

    Jerry

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  • Yes Jerry I too have found this company very good, excellent prices, quick service and well produced product. Just hope the purity is good . My husband and I have been taking Rapamycin and Metformin also from this company since August 2018 with no ill affects.

    Reply Like
  • jpurc

    Just a report on the Dasatinib and Quercetin I have been taking.  I have now taken the recommended dose with a weekly interval between them. The first dose was on Sunday March 10th and in the evening I had a headache which lasted into the night.  I took an aspirin and the headache went away.  I had no further side effects.

    The second dose was on Sunday March 17th and there were no side effects.

    I am 90 years old, so I was very pleased that the second dose didn't give me a headache, but just in case there was any blood thickening I took an aspirin.

    It is now a week since I took my second dose and I have noticed a small weight drop from 152 lbs  to 149 lbs., but that is the only difference so far and no change in my eating pattern. I will keep you posted about this.

    Reply Like 1
  • I finished the second dose of D + Q last week, No ill effects. I have not really noticed any changes at all.

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  • The D+Q protocol released by Bill Faloon contains several specific instructions I am curious about:

    1) 2.5 mg/kg of Dasatinib. Where did this dosage come from?

    2) take D +Q on an empty stomach. Why?

    3) No strenuous exercise for one week after taking D+Q? Why? and why one week?

    Any known answers or even speculation would be appreciated.

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  • Well, since there were no takers I will speculate myself:

    1) Don't know about dosage but it is good that the recommendation is individualized and based on body weight.

    2) The only reason I can think of is better absorption since there have been anecdotal reports of nausea after taking D+Q and who would sign up for that unless an empty stomach aids absorption.

    However, according to the PDR it appears that food does NOT impair absorption. In fact, a fatty meal may help:
    "Effects of food: Dasatinib absorption is not significantly affected by food. In subjects who received a single dasatinib 100-mg dose with a high-fat meal (fat, 52%: carbohydrates, 34%; and protein, 14%), the mean AUC increased by 14% compared with fasted subjects.[60087]"

    https://www.pdr.net/drug-summary/Sprycel-dasatinib-115.8464

    (scroll to very bottom of page)

    Perhaps quercetin absorption is  better when fasting.

    3) Either this is a caution to avoid problems with potential side effects or it is to allow  enough time for the D+Q to do its job without interference from exercise. Strenuous exercise might prevent the destruction of senescent cells?

    Reply Like
      • djmichel
      • CDR Phx
      • djmichel
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      Ozone8  I read the study and it seems that AUC, (the area under the curve (AUC) is the definite integral in a plot of drug concentration in blood plasma vs. time.)  This would mean taking Dasatnib with a meal that has a fat content of approximately 50% would result in a 15% greater concentration of Dasatnib in the blood.  So I surmise that the instruction of taking on an empty stomach is to  insure that the blood concentrations do not exceed the calculated dosages.  As to limiting exercise it is probably due to some studies that indicate the Dasatnib can cause Pulmonary  Atrial Hypertension.  Exercise with Dasatnib may exacerbate Pulmonary Hypertension due to increased Pulmonary stress, so waiting a week for Dasatnib clearance is probably recommended with due caution.   https://erj.ersjournals.com/content/48/suppl_60/OA262?utm_source=TrendMD&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=_European_Respiratory_Journal_TrendMD_0

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      • Ozone8
      • Ozone8
      • 1 mth ago
      • Reported - view

      djmichel Thanks for the clarifications. Wouldn't it be reasonable to take the Dasatinib with a fatty meal and adjust the dosage downward 10-15%? The less taken the better it would seem.

      As far as the exercise, I appreciate the reference you provided. The abstract states that "key questions remain regarding the long-term evolution of dasatinib-induced PAH and the mechanism(s) involved" and also "chronic dasatinib therapy causes pulmonary endothelial damage in humans". It appears that in this article at least the concern is directed to chronic dasatinib usage.

      What would constitute the "strenuous" exercise cautioned against? Is that running a marathon or intense weight training? Or would it also include  playing a recreational softball or soccer game and brisk walking?

      Finally, wouldn't all the dasatinib be cleared from the blood stream within 24 hours? If so, why a one-week restrictions from exercise? Would one-time usage cause enough damage to require such a time for pulmonary endothelial repair/regeneration?

      Reply Like
      • djmichel
      • CDR Phx
      • djmichel
      • 1 mth ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

      Ozone8 As far as I know the rules were determined by some study that I have no data on.  I suppose you could take a fatty meal, but why,  I have just followed the Life Extension protocol and everything has been ok.  So I take according to my weight, fast, and abstain from exercise for a week.  No problems so far. getting ready for the second round.

      Reply Like 1
    • @djmichel   I find your postings useful and inspirational.

      I just received my order of 1 kg of rapamycin and 10gms of dasatinib in powdered form from China.  I will have them analyzed before I use them.

      I have been on Metformin 2 gms per day for about 8 years, since I noticed my morning glucose level was around 110.  Low-carbing, Metformin keep my A1C about 5.3.  Just added Acarbose for those times when I have no choice and have to consume a few carbs (my 65th birthday, e.g.). It is pretty great, once one gets used to it.  Does a good job of mopping up French fries and whole grain bread.  Quercetin, Pomegranate Extract, Boswellia, all seem to keep my PSA around 2.7, (which has increased about 1 over the last 10 years), though admittedly, my prostate is about twice as big as it should be.  Dad died at 83 from PC.  I also take Telmisartan, Nebivolol, and Amlodipine for BP, Tadalafil and Alfuzosin for BPH. 

      I've recently done the Mayo Clinic Fisetin protocol about three times, using a bit higher dosage than the "frail old ladies."  And I also stacked on some high doses of intermittent Azithromycin.

      So, Blood work:  I have noticed some abnormalities over the years and they have concerned me, because there is just no possible benign reason for them.  Total Serum protein is 60 (should be at least 66), normal albumin, so I guess the globulins must be a bit low overall.  Leukemia, anyone?  Atrophied thymus maybe?  Except the numbers all taken separately are normal to low normal.  The monocytes percentage has been as high as 12.5%, though the absolute numbers were .7 before I did the Fisetin.  Now, it's .5 and 10%.  PSA dropped to 2.3.  EGFR improved.  FGL, too.  I also take a 10mg Lipitor daily with 2 grams of instant release Niacin, ever since my doctor told me about 12 years ago that I was starting to build up some plaque in my carotids (about 33%).  That's apparently now down to 25%.  That's because my regimen boosted my HDL almost to the same level as LDL, and TG are almost not there.  The only worrisome thing is my D-Dimer which has been as high as 2000 and now is back down to about 1300, when it shouldn't be over 650.  I've been checked out for everything, every kind of cancer, pulmonary thrombosis, DVT, etc.  Nothing.  Clean stress test, too. I'm on TRT (Nebido).  It isn't cheap but seems to work well with few side effects.

      My doctor tells me not to worry about blood tests so much, that I'm a bit of a hypochondriac and questions why I take so many vitamins, etc.  (German doctors hate that stuff).  I fly to Ukraine and buy most things without a prescription.   I also lift three times a week, and keep my 45 year old wife drooling over my six-pack.   Just did a 4000km motorcycle tour through Eastern Europe last year with my 11-year-old son and am doing it again this year with my 12-year-old daughter on the back.  Grueling?  A bit.  I can do 100 sit-ups and 50 push-ups if I REALLY have to.

      If I have one real worry, it's that I've from time to time awakened from a dream with slight movement and fear RBD and the almost certain Parkinson's that'll come eventually.  For that reason, I take 5 mg of Selegiline a day.  The Hungarian doctor who invented it sold me on it.  That and Melatonin (15mg each night) seem to have kept it under control.

      Nobody cares about you and your health more than you.  Getting old ain't for sissies.   See you around the pool.

      Reply Like
  • Gravil,  great post as to your protocol.  Impressive.  I take around 40 vitamins a day, all based on studies.  I do not have excessive vascular calcium buildup, although I had a Calcium score performed and I came back with a minimal score, although it was still indicative of some buildup, but pretty good for 77. I did find a study that indicated that taking Policosanol can reverse Calcium buildup in the vascular system.  Let me know the results of your order and who you purchased them from.

    Best,

    David

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16099319

    Reply Like
  • Will do.  I bought the stuff from a dealer on alibaba. I'll post when I have it analyzed.

    Reply Like 1
  • Started my biannual second round of D+Q this morning. Took on an empty stomach and will advise of any problems.  I had intended to start this round last month which would have been 6 months since my last round but was traveling.  I am still taking 5mg of Rapamycin every two weeks plus a daily regimen of supplements that would choke a horse.  All is good but that does remind me of the guy who jumped out of the Empire State building and as he fell past the 50th floor he yelled all is good so far.  

    Reply Like 1
      • djmichel
      • CDR Phx
      • djmichel
      • 6 days ago
      • 1
      • Reported - view

       So an update on my second biannual round of D-Q.  Well that pretty well kicked butt.  Had a lot of flu symptoms, achy fingers and joints, headache, and general malaise with slight nausea.  Ate light, and took it easy. Took an aspirin mid day and that helped a lot.  Slept well, the second day was still a little tired but much better. Today day three all is good.  feel well and good again.  Out and about.  

      Reply Like 1
  • Ya know, DJ, I feel the same way.  If there were only some way to know whether or not this stuff is really helping . . .  All I can say for certain is that, whenever I do a two day course of high-dose fisetin, my brain fog clears, and I feel as if I have more energy.  😄  Still awaiting results on my Chinese dasatinib and rapamycin.

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    • Gavril Villiamovich what is the dose of fisetin on your 2 day dose protocol

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    • are we there yet - See below, my friend.

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  • I weigh 90 kilos, so the recommendation is 180mg for the frail old ladies, two days in a row.  I take 300mg, cause I'm not a frail old lady.

    BTW, I just updated my profile photo.  I don't think I look too bad for 65.  Mama thinks I look better without a beard, so I might have to lose it.

    Weird, I did this on Monday and Tuesday, had my workout today, and I just KILLED it.  I don't know WHAT got into me, but dang, I feel good.  This is the 4th time this year I've done this.  Those senescent cells have got to be getting scarce!  Starting a dasatinib/quercetin regimen in a week from Saturday.  Goin' after ALL those pesky zombies! 

    Now, momma, get out of that bathroom!  Papa's feelin' MIGHTY frisky tonight!

    Reply Like
      • djmichel
      • CDR Phx
      • djmichel
      • 6 days ago
      • Reported - view

       Are you taking any Aromatse inhibitors?  One of my docs said it was important to keep esterdiols low as high esterdiol can cause heart problems, prostate problems in that esterdiol is suspect in many cancers.  I take 1/4 of 1 mg twice a month, on the 1st and 15th.  I also take a cruciferous vegetable extract containing DIM daily.  I have followed this protocol for 15 years.  My Urologist tells me that my prostrate is of normal size and my PSA Scoure 2.1.  Not too bad for 77 years old. 

      Also I was wondering about the info provided to you by your doc about the use of Deprenyl to prevent Parkinson disease. What is your daily intake.  A study a few years found benefit to those already suffering from Parkinsons.  

      https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22592509

      BTW your posts sound like you live in Europe?  Is that correct.  I live in South Florida on the ocean. 

      Reply Like
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