Fisetin experimentation one year (reposted as topic for info purposes)
Hello everyone I wanted to make my first post here as I have been doing a fisetin routine for a year now just about and I have results that are not placebo and very profound. I honestly do not know if this is the senylotic effect or some kind of interaction with fisetin in other ways.
To get it out of the way, I will give the fast and short version. I am taking Swanson’s Fisetin. I take around 2g a day for 3 days( now 2.5g). I repeat this for 3 or 4 times with varying intervals (I was trying to find optimal intervals).
My my first regimen was 3 days treatment with a 2 week delay, then a 3 week delay, then a 4 week delay, then a 2 month delay. I am now convinced a 3 week delay is the minimal amount of time you want taking this the way I am, though I will continue with 4 week delay for safety sake and because of my own observations.
So results. Well I feel like this must play on hormone levels in the short term. Immediately after starting a 3 day regimen, usually on day 2 or 3 I feel strong as hell. In particular my legs are tight and super strong. My muscles in general are firmer and overall strength is amazing. My mind is clear, thinking concise anddynamic. I feel more dominant, self confident, and aggressive. Libido is enhanced as well. This all led me to believe that this acts as a testosterone mimic or elevates testosterone in the blood which is why I cycle monthly and then take a few months off every so often.
i can tell you that at the age of 43 this makes me legitimately remember what early 20s feels like. The effects of one 3 day regimen last strongly for 2 weeks and even on for 4 weeks. In particular during week one and two I was amazed at the amount of pure emotion and clarity of the world around me. I could hear and appreciate sounds and colors seemed more vibrant. Mentally I am on overdrive with super memory and crystal clear logical thinking. I remember the first time I took this I was shocked. I was in a cafe just looking at a coke I had bought in a glass amazed at how more real and present it looked. A small thing but it was profound just how the world seemed more alive. It literally felt like going back in time 20 years.
So for long term effects. A stronger posture, better muscle tone, improved gum health, vastly more energy, in fact this has become all the norm after around 8 months of this. Many of the effects I described in the first two weeks following a 3 day regimen do taper off to an extent, but never completely.
As far as side effects there has not been anything thus far. When you are taking the 3 day dose you might get amped up a little jittery but that gives way quickly after the last dosage and it normalizes into a even effect that is positive in nature. I was very concerned about hair loss as I could not believe how impactful this was. But I have noticed no hair loss at all. I cycle it with a 3 or 4 week break to ensure that there is no negative effect on hair or otherwise. With a two week interval I had some scalp itchiness. That was enough to back me off to to four week intervals.
I honestly think that most of what I experienced is not the senylotic effect. It’s way too fast and profound. But I have no ill effects and feel incredible. And overall I have a youthful vigor and look and feel younger. I think a senylotic evaluation, as far as a laymen just observing himself goes ,can only really be done after 2 years or so. However the initial results ( especially gum health) and from what else I can observe are overwhelmingly positive.
I can tell you that this does have an affect and it is profound and noticeable. How much of this is hormone I do not know. But I have other improved health as well, however it’s always tricky to quantify this objectively yourself sometimes.
Good luck on your experiments. Let me know if this has the same effect for you. I just bought Swanson’s with nouvestein. Nothing fancy. Cheap and on amazon.
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Hi Fisetin Fans, I just discovered this site and have read all 122 comments which are mostly from David C. Thank you David for sharing your results in detail. I have been following and posting on a similar thread which you might find interesting here:
Here is my experience so far. I am 71 so mostly interested in the longer, slower senolytic effects not the short term ones that David has shown. I used the Mayo Clinic protocol which resulted in 1.5 grams a day for 2 days (based on my 70kg weight). Repeat after one month and again after 6 months. I have tried breaking up the capsules and mixing with olive oil and just taking them with water. Results after one year have been disappointing. Like most people here and on the other forum I feel no positive changes in aging related health problems, of which I have few.
I am concerned about the low bio-availablilty of Fisetin. I've read that the solubility in water is only 0.151 mg per ml. This works out to 571 mg per US gallon so you should be really drinking about 2 gallons of water per gram!!
I know that LE has come out with bio-fisetin that contains a special fiber but they show no links to any science that proves this works although someone wrote here that it was proven. Please provide us a link on that. Also LE has a mix of 3 nutracetils that they call Senolytic Activator but there is no science on that either.
I will continue to search for a senolytic that provides results for humans, not just mice but so far it doesn't seem to be matching up.
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Dean W. Dean, I have also had significantly different results using the the Swanson product following the Mayo protocol. I experienced an "immediate" increase in strength based on my regular exercise program ( not placebo). This was quantifiable. I also "believe" that my color vision improved significantly, but this is an opinion as I did not have any benchmarks to compare as I did with my exercise program.
I did not see an change in my blood chemistry and the Levin phenotype age and DNAm age from before use to after use.
I do not know what caused the strength improvements and doubt that they were due to removal of senescent cells due to the immediate improvements in strength.
Note that as you indicated several others have reported similar changes. Mine may be due to my age -- 80rears old.
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Van, I am lucky to have good genes as I am only 5 lbs. heavier than my high school weight and my blood tests have always been consistent. For example, cholesterol between 150 and 160. But I would think I have some senescent cells somewhere by now (age 71). My back bothers me and MRIs show disc degeneration which is a very common symptom of aging. I did a Google Scholar search on "Lumbar disc AND senescence" and found several recent articles suggesting senescence might be the reason for disc degeneration of aging. So I continue to try.
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Dean W. Just a side note: I'm 74, & have had herniated disc for 15-20 years. At beginning I was unable to walk without a walker, but after looking for more holistic approaches, took course of about 25 daily, pretty non-invasive, 30-minute treatments of spinal decompression. I've seen MRIs of studies, & that protocol actually expands the discs. Worth investigating. For past 10-15 years I do a short course of spinal decompression as prophylactic. Related, supplementing with some vits, etc. will help. CMO (Cetyl Myristoleate) both topically & internally is helpful.
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Michael_B By spinal decompression, did that include use of an inversion table? Did you find that the increased disc height was reflected in your overall height?
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chuck stanley Are you joking? There are several spinal decompression machines, all computer controlled, and range in cost to practitioner from about $15,000 - $100,000. Below is just one example:
https://excitemedical.com/drx9000-lumbar-decompression/
No changes in height, except ability to walk upright, vs bent over.
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As I have noticed from reading forums for years, there are significant differences in how people respond to the same substance or drug. It is rather astounding! Some drugs have shown comments that range from "really worked great for me" to "the worst thing I ever took". I guess that is why we are all here reporting results of our experiments. I wonder how much of this is due to the placebo effect. I have read that in some people/cases long lasting improvement for a certain condition (such as knee pain) can be as high as 50% using just a placebo. This is true even if people were told beforehand that it was just a placebo!!
That is just weird.
There was great story on NPR about this in the past month or so. Can't find it now.
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Dean W. yes, the mind is very powerful. I discount all the anecdotes about feeling stronger, more alert, more energy as purely placebo. Give me several blood tests that show an improvement before I'll believe.
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Paul Beauchemin Well once you feel it than you will believe it..You feel more alive...if it is a placebo then bring it on but i have never been able to get this by positive thinking. .. i think life style makes a difference as well... I do meditation which increases telomeres length appreciably also do organic green juice etc.... Pain in my prostate is reduced for sure.... not sure that can be placebo based. Also my yoga is better than ever and I have been doing it for 40 years.....I have never been able to stretch like this and I am not even straining.... if this is placebo then we should all be in this place
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Dean W. Decades ago Richard Passwater wrote about biochemical individuality. I just learned he died in April, at age 84. I've also been a long-time advocate of placebo -- just an extension of positive thinking! And virtually all "healthy" blood ranges, & other standards, are simply averages of an unhealthy population -- not at all related to optimal health, nor anti--aging
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Paul, I agree on discounting most of those instant effects as placebo.
Just read more on Life Extensions's new product, bio-available fisetin. They claim the human digestive tract converts fisetin into a useless form and that some manufacturer has discovered that a natural fiber extract from the herb fenugreek prevents this. The study is not published yet and is written by the manufacturer:
Akay. A cross over pilot pharmacokinetic study of fisetin 1000mg and formulated fisetin 200mg administered in a single dose to healthy volunteers. Manufacturer’s study (in press for future publication) . 2020.
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Dean W. All this fuss over fisetin availability doesnt seem justified. People are taking it as a senolytic and getting results, so there doesnt seem to be a need for fixing a problem that doesnt exist. Now if people werent getting results, fine, but that isnt the case.
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Fred Cloud And all. Agree with you Fred. In my case Swanson's fisetin following Mayo protocol works. It was not placebo as my chin ups increased immediately from 20 to 26. Pull ups went from 22 to 28. This was not "feeling good" effect and is as much as a biomarker as any blood test. The increase was immediate following the first two day There was no improvement in my Levin Pheno or DNA m from blood test before and after. I cannot quantify improvement in vision color improvement but it happened.
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Dean W. Can anyone say rapamycin cream? LOL If ever a larger con game existed, perpetuated by otherwise "credentialed physicians" on this board, I have yet to see it: precisely, before and after examples.
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Fred Cloud Fred, I have read many more comments that people had no noticeable changes, including me. The reasons for that are not known but chemistry shows the solubility in water is only 0.151 mg per ml. Not much. It is better in alcohol but not so good that you would not get totally drunk trying to dissolve a gram of it. I can't argue with chemistry. Senolytic effects would not happen overnight but would take weeks to months.
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Dean W. taking weeks to months to show? I dont think so. Why do you say that?
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Michael I'm trying it. I've used it for about 3 weeks on the back of one hand. No difference so far but I imagine if it works it will take months. Unfortunately, my hands are not very aged so it will be subtle. I'll send a pic out in the future and let others decide if they can see a difference. 60 male.
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Larry Thank you!
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Larry Since your hands are not very aged you may not notice it...it takes a long time to get results...
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Michael What are you talking about con job? I sent you to all my posts with Dr mark who graciously is sharing with us his experiences with his patients and on himself and his family on the Topical Rapamycin cream. In the series of posts he talked about a published study on this topical cream which was rather remarkable in that not only were wrinkles visually reduced markedly but also the senolytic cells were almost all removed from the skin. Granted it took 8 months to complete. Pretty amazing study as they also had photos. So when you talk about con jobs a published study is far from a con job. Dr Mark is very busy and gets nothing from posting and so your judgements do him a great disservice. Personally he has been a great help to me and I have been able to help others from what I learned. We are not on here to send you photos.... nor to convince to try anything. But simply to share what we experience and hopefully help others in their journey.
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garland You're right. I should have not chosen that phrase. I appreciate all the information you've passed on as well.
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garland HOWEVER. I do believe if people on this forum are going to make claims about successes they ABSOLUTELY need to provide evidence, especially a licensed MD. And, I can guarantee you I'm busier than anyone on this forum but would still take the time to provide evidence along with claims of success. I believe I posted blood work from several months ago openly asking for feedback. That's what the spirit of the community should be; TOTAL transparency - Not selective bs.
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Michael A licensed MD? Greatest danger to ones health in many cases is a licensed MD. A Harvard study several years ago concluded that the greatest contribution to premature death is our medical community - Drs., hospitals, and pharmaceuticals.
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Peter H. Howe Couldn't agree more. That these sheep bow to them is nauseating.
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Larry How did you get your "hands" on the Rapamycin cream?
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ripeideas
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