Rejuvant?
Has anyone heard of this?
The speaker presented a talk indicating that users got substantial drop in DNA methylation age results - I seem to recall an average of 8 years after 6 months usage
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I have taken 2 different DNAm tests and after 6 months of Rejuvant it did not lower my epigenetic age in either test. I'm debating on whether to continue taking Rejuvant...
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Fred Cloud I used mydnage.com at 4 months and their test at 6 month. No significant changes in epi age. I'm disappointed.
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Jimmy2 Did you take a before test or just at 4 months? I took the mydnage test before and will retest at 6 months. I am not taking rejuvant though, I just went out and bought the same active ingredient, ca-akg for a fraction of the price as rejuvant.
Is there a reason you are paying so much money for rejuvant brand of ca-akg versus just buying generic ca-akg?
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Fred Cloud
mydnage:
- 10/01/2021
- 41 Calendar Age
- 39 years DNAm age
- -2.3 years
- 1//27/2021
- 41 Calendar Age
- 28 DNAm age
- -2.5 years
- In this test I got barely younger.
- Could be in error range.
trume:
- 11/23/2020
- 39.6 Calendar age
- 41.3 DNAm age
- -1.7 years
- 4/29/2021
- 41.9 Calendar age
- 40.6 DNAm age
- -1.3 years
- So I got older faster, but just barely.
- Could be in error range.
- 10/01/2021
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Fred Cloud Rejuvant is what I consider a premium supplment. Dr. Brian Kennedy runs the Buck Institute. He is somewhat involved with the creation of Rejuvant. That's the reason I am paying a premium. Is it worth it? Maybe.
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Jimmy2 I looked into it. Ca-akg is ca-akg, they probably get it from the same exact manufacturer. Aminos all have high purity, so there isnt a difference between suppliers as they are all basically commodities of the same quality. So there is no valid reason to pay a premium for Rejuvant.
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Fred Cloud Without a third party test who knows which is more pure. It’s like buying generics versus the original. Rejuvant was first to sell CaAKG. Before there were other forms for body building.
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Jimmy2 I meant to say 38 DNAm age above for 1/27. Not sure how to edit.
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Jimmy2 Does it have to be the calcium AKG? How much calcium is in a serving?
Can one use the AAKG instead?
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Chris All the studies on AKG in longevity have been done only with Ca-AKG, so nobody knows if any of the other versions work. I wouldn't waste my money on the other versions until more studies come out. Listen to the lead researcher on this issue: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPuHXjZIaAc
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Brin Chikovski If you want ca-akg then buy the generic brand that costs a fraction of Rejuvant.
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Brin Chikovski Thanks! I'm just concerned on how much calcium is in a serving, do you know?
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Chris In the Rejuvant product its 190mg of Calcium per 1,000 mg of AKG. I suspect its close to the same for all the Ca-AKG products. I've emailed MaxxHerb to ask them about their Calcium levels. Fundamentally - its a small amount, so I wouldn't worry about it. The RDA for Calcium is 1,000 mg / day.
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Brin Chikovski Rejuvant website indicates the Buck institute used their sustained release product in their studies. Do we know if it is particularly important that the product be sustained release AKG?
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chuck stanley I think the Rejuvant website may be misleading here. In this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPuHXjZIaAc&t=9s
Gordon Lithgow says that they used the CA-AKG version of the molecule in mice because that is what had proven effective in worms in earlier studies.
I believe they just used the time release version of CA-AKG in the mouse studies that were published in this paper (not the full rejuvant formula that includes some other supplement ingredients):
https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/779157v1.full.pdf
And I seem to remember in one video interview with Gordon Lithgow - he mentioned that PDLH then took the CA-AKG and added some other supplements to the mix as they made their version of AKG and also male and female specific versions of ca-AKG (but again, these were not part of the studies completed by the Buck).
Now - I believe there are other new studies being done with the Rejuvant in humans using the new Rejuvant commercial product - as is discussed here, and this may be what the PDLH / REjuvant website is talking about:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ctrfZ3QoqTI&t=585s
Brian Kennedy does mention in one of his interviews - perhaps this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Jg6jexruZ4&t=518s
That Ca-AKG does have a short half-life of a few hours so if you aren't taking the time-release version (i.e. just the generic CA-AKG powder) you need to take it more often.
Given the cost difference - I'm ok with that.
Price of Rejuvant is $110 to $150 for a 30 day supply (taking two tablets with a total of 1,000mg / 1 gram of CA-AKG per day. Cost per gram of CA-AKG is in the $3 to $5 per gram range,
Price of MAXXherb Ca-AKG powder is in the range of $42 to $46 per 100 grams, so approx. $0.42 to $0.46 per gram for the same thing.
S0, you're paying a 600% to 1,000% higher price for the Rejuvant for time release. Seems like too high a premium to me.
I've used Rejuvant for 4 months, and then switched to MaxxHerb. I can't tell the difference.
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Chris Study on dietary and supplemental calcium says,
" Use of calcium tablets (6% users; 500 mg calcium per tablet) was not on average associated with all cause or cause specific mortality but among calcium tablet users with a dietary calcium intake above 1400 mg/day the hazard ratio for all cause mortality was 2.57 (95% confidence interval 1.19 to 5.55)."
https://www.bmj.com/content/346/bmj.f228 -
Jimmy2 Thanks!
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Fred Cloud I agree that Rejuvant is too expensive.
In answer to your question the Rejuvant site (https://rejuvant.com/How-Rejuvant-Works) indicates that the product is "patent-pending sustained release combination of Calcium and Alpha-Ketoglutarate." I believe the men's formula may also contain vitamin A. From what I've read sustained-release may be a better approach to maintaining a constant level in the body.
While doing a bit of research on this I found no other version of sustained-release except a product from Swanson Vitamins that is no longer in stock.
So, maybe this sustained-release aspect is why it costs so much more? I certainly don't know.
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Jay Orman Its the ca-akg that creates the sustained release, so just find a ca-akg from another supplier. AKG has been found to work also, so I think they just want something unique that they can patent so they can mark the price way up, that is the way things work in business. If it is a commodity they cant raise the price up as high. There are alot of gullible people who respond to marketing, it is what has made this country rich. So if you want to pay for marketing, go ahead. If not, buy generic ca-akg.
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Fred Cloud Thanks for the information. I didn't know that. Do you have a source that talks more about the sustained release aspect of ca-akg?
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Guys, Rejuvant is extended (slow release), whereas other AKG formulations on the market are immediate release (as of 04/2021). I believe AKG is metabilized fast, and to get the same effect, one has to consume immediate-release AKG every 4 hours. I'm sure Rejuvant went through stringent quality checks as well, given the premium price and the brand they're building.
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Don’t know how true this is but I’ve read some “reliable” sources that AKG can reduce DNAm age. However, if you combine it with Metformin it won’t reduce DNAm age. Although there could be other beneficial effects. 🤷🏻♂️ I’m still undecided. I’m sure more papers will come out on this, hopefully sooner than later.
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Jimmy2
What's the evidence that "if you combine AKG with Metformin, it won’t reduce DNAm age" (but presumably will otherwise)?
Fred Cloud said that AKG shows life extension effects because it inhibits Mtor and activates AMPK. If it is acting like both Metformin and Rapamycin on the same life extension pathways, why would it have a different effect on epigenetic reprogramming (as indicated by DNAme age)? What is the evidence, aside from the questionable Rejuvant sale pitch, that it does any epigenetic reprogramming at all?
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JGC I can’t go into detail, but watch Gordon Lithgow on AKG on the YouTube channel Modern Healthspan. In it he says he test various combinations of drugs on worms. Certain combination lower lifespan. That’s why he is skeptical of people taking many supplements. He’s part of the Buck Institute that tests CaAKG. It’s only a hunch at this point. That’s all I have.
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Jimmy2
OK, I have now read the Buck Institute AKG paper and watched two of the Lithgow interviews on Modern Healthspan. I also watched some other videos on YouTube about the Buck Institute's AKG results.
I gather from what Lithgow said that there is not likely to be much difference in the effects from Revuvant's time-release CaAKG versus the generally available Arginine AKG (Swanson @ $7.67 for 90 x 1,000 mg caps). The Buck experimenters simply used CaAKG on their mouse subjects because that is what had been previously used on C. Elegans worms in similar studies.
Alpha-ketoglutarate, in whatever form, is highly soluble in water, so there should be no bioavailability issues. I did find a paper stating that in pigs, AKG remains resident in the bloodstream with a half-life of only about 5 minutes, so the time-release form of AKG should have added value. However, since one wants the AKG in cells, not blood, the rapid absorption rate may not altogether bad.
On the question of whether AKG can be expected to provide some level of epigenetic reprogramming, the Revuvant AKG promotion seems to be the only thing I could find that suggests this. AKG does play a role in DNA methylation and de-methylation, but that cannot be taken as an indication that taking it produces epigenetic reprogramming. Further, your experience indicates that it does not, at least in one case.
I have just ordered several bottes of Arginine AKG from Swanson.
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JGC Nice work on doing your own research. Right now the evidence is based laboratory evidence on worms by the Buck Institute. Also, Rejuvant has done pilot studies that shows it reduces epi-age. The science community generally doesn't believe in pilot studies. Also, Rejuvant has administered TruMe epi-age tests to many users of Rejuvant. So, they actually have data to work with, but it's all internal evidence. It just seems that Rejuvant doesn't work for everyone, and it affects people differently. So, yes, we are reliant on one single company and their data. The good news is an RCT trial is in progress, which is the gold standard of tests.
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