Rapamycin Cost

chuck stanley Best to try again on the Age Reversal Network web site.  Try a few different times, some days there's exceptional traffic or maintenance.

https://age-reversal.net/age-management-telehealth-updates/ 

But if that still doesn't work, send an email to AgeMgmtTelehealthPhysicians@gmail.com or call me at 949-922-9786

JohnnyAdams thanks, yes we already emailed and I live in Maryland so I  understand I'm not eligible at this time.

Chris Los That is extremely disappointing!  From a 6mg dose I would have expected at least 24ng/ml.

Thanks for sharing that information. In retrospect I believe the reps at Zhejiang Multinpharma served as middlemen, so the others of us who purchased from Zhejiang may or may not have been duped.  It may depend on the agent as to which supplier's product is traded. (in my case, and those who recommended Zhejiang to me, our agent was "Rainbow").

In any event I will stop using my powder until I can get around to testing. And for the heck of it I may contact "Rainbow" about this to see if she wants to offer any explanation. 

Chris Los I regret your very bad experience. Thanks for sharing this valuable information. I will certainly avoid Zhejiang Multinpharma Co., Ltd. You may want to share this experience with https://www.rapamycin.news/ . The more we can share information about reliable and unreliable companies the better for all of us.

MAC. Please keep us informed about WuHan Hengheda.  This company is on my list of possibly reliable, but I'm still investigating.  

MAC. thanks a lot for sharing. fingers crossed for the new shipment. pls do share blood results from the WuHan sirolimus. grateful for the intel! good luck

Vega Rejuvinated Are you buying this transdermal product for internal systemic mTOR modification or simply for topical skin anti-aging benefit? I assume you are looking for systemic, since you made reference to your interest in vendor offering cream as "replacement" for capsules.

The vendor makes the following claim:

"Transdermal delivery is a perfect way to deliver Rapamycin into the body as it bypasses the digestive system which can breakdown rapamycin. This type of delivery is used to deliver such treatments as hormone replacement therapy. Transdermal cream will deliver Rapamycin into circulation through the skin...which bypasses any absorption issues"

There are NO scientific references/data to support their product claims. They take extreme license by equating their cream with HRT cream systemic efficacy. 

The key is "into the body", which appears to be equating bioavailability similar to traditional oral route. 

Some digging on topical/transdermal cream Rapamycin dosing formulations. 

This study of topical Rapamycin:

"Topical Rapamycin reduces markers of senescence and aging in human skin: an exploratory, prospective, randomized trial"

https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs11357-019-00113-y

utilized a 0.001% concentration, and no results/discussion in relation to any measurable levels of blood Sirolimus.

This study

"Efficacy and Safety of Topical Rapamycin in Patients With Facial Angiofibromas Secondary to Tuberous Sclerosis Complex: The TREATMENT Randomized Clinical Trial"

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29800048/

utilizes a topical Rapamcyin for Facial Angiofibromas Secondary to Tuberous Sclerosis Complex (TSC), at two dosing regiments, 0.1% and 1%. These are orders of magnitude more concentrated than the study above for anti-aging skin rejuvenation.

As for dosing, "Patients were provided the experimental product and instructed to apply 1 pump (1.0 mL) of product at bedtime to areas designated at the time of enrollment for 6 months."

So 1.0mL of the highest 1% concentration cream would deliver 10mg of Rapamycin to a very localized TSC area (in this study, facial)

What is most notable in this study "Serum Rapamycin was assessed in patient blood samples by immunoassay (lower limit of detection <0.5 ng/mL). Initially, blood samples were collected monthly from all patients.  After Rapamycin was not detected in the first several hundred samples, monthly blood sampling was discontinued" So even daily dosing of 1% concentration did not deliver any systemic Rapamycin.

From my brief read of the the topical Rapamycin literature for human application, there is NO intention to deliver systemic wide detectable levels of Rapamycin akin to oral dosing. There is no FDA approved use of topical Rapamycin for any SYSTEMIC disease. https://www.drugs.com/pro/sirolimus.html#s-34067-9

Now back to Rapamycin.store transdermal cream product and the "into the body" Rapamycin delivery claim.

Vendor claims 120 mg in a 20ml of "transdermal cream". Assume the cream has the room temperature density of DSMO (1.1 g/cm3). So 120mg in 20 ml (22g) is equivalent to approximately 0.55% Rapamycin cream solution. Vendor also instructs "apply the desired amount to freshly washed and dried skin once weekly"

Now clearly from the Topical Rapamycin/TSC study above, there was NO RAPAMYCIN DETECTED at 1% cream concentration on DAILY dosing? So why would a 0.55% Rapamycin cream applied ONCE WEEKLY deliver systemic, blood detectable levels of Rapamycin? Even daily dosing would not produce blood detectable levels.

It would appear this vendor has replaced one unproven product with yet another.

MAC. very much agree with this! Keep in mind that Sirolimus is routinely used orally in organ transplant patients at around 2mg per day. Blood levels in steady state are around 4-10 ng/ml. 

If our 6mg dosis measured at peak levels after ingestion (around 2 hours) does not show up in blood tests, this has nothing to do with absorption but everything with the nature of the substance! No sirolimus in the blood - no sirolimus in the powder or pill that you took. 

Too many companies are feeding on our desperate efforts to get the magic pill...:-) Any changes in generic blood parameters then become a self-fulfilling prophecy...

Sometimes science is simple - if there is no sirolimus in the blood then you did not take sirolimus. 

Vega Rejuvinated Need a baseline reference panel, and then another after the Rapamycin dosing (assuming no other dietary/med/supplement changes, controlling for just Rapamycin). Not sure how long you should wait after you start dosing for the next panel. You need to allow for the full half life cycle build up, and your body to adjust to the Rapamycin. Maybe couple months? Also monitor your weight.

What is your dosing plan?

As for blood panel:

Sirolimus (preferably a multi blood draw every 30 mins for 2 hrs post dose)

Lipids

CBC

Glucose

hbA1c

hsCRP

eGFR

Albumin

Creatinine

Albumin/Creatinine

Uric Acid

ALT

ALP

GGT

Ferritin

Chris Los China commerce works in many dark and mysterious ways; middlemen, resellers, traders, etc. It definitely appears "shady" to western governance standards.

This vendor was vetted (by repeated 3rd party Rapamycin testing) by another poster.

I have a local, low cost lab to do a Rapamycin analysis to confirm veracity. Only then will I proceed with bioavailability experimentation. 

MAC. Glad ol USA commerce is always upstanding and operates in best interest of all. No shady operatives here.

BrianMDelaney community experimentation, love it! thanks for that Brian, this test design will provide an important piece of the puzzle. 

24h after taking a dose should still conveniently put you in the 4-10ng/ml range that standard tests will pick up (based on pharmacokinetics studies with 2.5mg sirolimus). 

good luck and thanks a lot!

BrianMDelaney , Have you had time to complete this test.  I am very interested in the results.  Thanks.

Jay Orman Hi Jay. No, it's going to be a while, unfortunately. I've been doing other experiments, plus, now I'm out of the US for a month without access to the LabCorp sirolimus/rapamycin blood test.

I will definitely report on the results as soon as I have them! Depending on my travel, I would estimate I'll have the results by the end of June.

chuck stanley very sad, my rep was also very defensive and even accused me that I ruined their PayPal account (they used the term dasatinib for the transaction and that got supposedly picked up by PayPal...I never used the term). I have had it with Chinese trading companies like Zhejiang and also HengHeDa - another Wuhan based trading company selling substances that they can never produce themselves. 

Chris Los I posted the experience on rapamycin.news. 

Chris Los 

Did you throw away all your “rapamycin” powder? I guess I should toss what I still have left in my freezer.

Recently I was looking for a cheaper source of Ca-AKG, something pharmaceutical grade. I got a good price from another Chinese company and it looked like they were a manufacturer, Xi’an Bioholdern Industry and Trade Co. They sent me a COA which was ostensibly for the Ca-AKG quoted to me. Get this: they cleverly altered an official COA for Calcium Acetate Lactate and changed the heading and CAS number to that of Ca-AKG. It certainly looked authentic, but they forgot to change the chemical formula and molecular weight!

I see people on this forum still boldly moving ahead to buy powders from Chinese companies. I too would like a better price for MNM or AKG or spermidine.  But Brin Chikovski was so right, “ I would only order product from China if you plan to have a third party lab test done when it is received - a lab that tests purity, and for common possible contaminants.”

chuck stanley amazing! thanks for sharing. and yes, yesterday I disposed off all of my  diluted rapa. It would have served me for 10 years if only it were the real thing. I keep a sample of the raw powder they sent in the freezer. Perhaps one day I am able to access a lab test...

So, let not greed turn us into desperate fools. no more orders from China. Will order generic tablets from India instead. 

Liam_Cohen happy to hear that you observe positive health-related developments - whatever the causal mechanisms involved is. However, concluding the your Sirolimus is legit is not appropriate. Given the strong positive expectation bias, only a blood test or a chemical test of the raw material counts as evidence. Even a chronically toxic substance may create positive effects in the short-mid term.

Chris Los Have had rapa powder sent in without problem to Spain.  I could get tablets in US, but my hunch is it is impossible in EU.  My powder was checked HPLC by a friend who has same problem in Canada.  We both used same company.  I have all the mouth sores to prove it is legitimate, and experience taking rapa for 5 years.  2nd. patient of Dr. Green

Van thanks a lot; I have become hesitant to trust powder brokers. mind sharing your source? 

Chris Los He just posted this on Rapamycin News: https://www.rapamycin.news/t/sirolimus-3rd-party-analysis/1333

Chris Los you may have found, as I recently have, that sirolimus powder is degraded in the stomach. Sirolimus must make it to the small intestine in order to be absorbed. So the fact that any sirolimus at all was found in your blood test makes me wonder if in fact the powder we got was real after all. I am buying some acid resistant capsules which dont dissolve until they reach the more alkaline environment. I remain wary of Chinese powders in general but I can no longer discredit that particular batch.

chuck stanley My sirolimus powder from WHP in China resulted in identical trough levels to what I obtained when taking equivalent doses of  "Rapamune" brand pills. I would concur, that if none found in blood, its the supplier that is likely the issue.

Steve Roedde agree, clinical data use tablets that are just compressed powder - however, perhaps branded tablets have some form of stabilization against acids? not aware of that. chuck stanley my blood test did not show any positive sirolimus levels. but the test sensitivity limit means it cannot reject the possibility of small concentrations.  but that does not prove the presence of sirolimus.

sadly, I am still without any source of sirolimus, currently....:-)

Chris Los  I’m curious about the sensitivity limit issue. You could always get a blood draw at peak... the absolute value would be meaningless of course, but if none at peak... there would be none... in the product. Mass spectroscopy a better alternative if available.